tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post5469671294591186135..comments2024-02-28T02:36:09.368-08:00Comments on The dotFuture Manifesto: Internet Crime, Web Services, Philosophy: Another third rate burglaryUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger32125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-13455114019605770402010-01-27T20:59:25.354-08:002010-01-27T20:59:25.354-08:00What sort of sentence would these people have been...What sort of sentence would these people have been demanding if a Republican had been targeted in similar circumstances? I think it is rather hard to believe that they would be satisfied with a slap on the wrist. In recent years the GOP has been rather keen on the idea of charging teenagers as adults. So now we have a bunch of mid-twenties trust fund babies and they think they should be let off because they were kids?PHBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10772216888166343026noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-79746345427340757982010-01-27T15:31:26.590-08:002010-01-27T15:31:26.590-08:00Terrance = Deterrence (sorry)Terrance = Deterrence (sorry)testesthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06721510971386867015noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-50088831940208525802010-01-27T15:29:47.062-08:002010-01-27T15:29:47.062-08:00I know marya has already apologized, but I would l...I know marya has already apologized, but I would like to bring up three points. 1. Yes, they are young twenty-somethings, kids really, and they are older than many of our young troops who join the military and put themselves in harm's way/ die for us. 2. (This has been mentioned, but should be reiterated) if this was a person who looked middle eastern, no matter how innocuous the facts, Fox news would be blaring on with conspiracies about what they were trying to do. 3. Terrance. No one should be trying to get inappropriate access to a government building, whether it be in Mississippi, Oklahoma, or any where else.testesthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06721510971386867015noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-34171240459934451412010-01-27T14:48:34.603-08:002010-01-27T14:48:34.603-08:00Like many posters here, I am delighted that these ...Like many posters here, I am delighted that these tactics have been exposed and, perhaps, discredited. I also believe that these smug clowns deserve to be appropriately punished for what they've done. However, I'm really uncomfortable with calls for "their lives to be destroyed, their families' lives to be destroyed". That's just vicious. Aren't we better than that?<br />One more thing: Let's not jump to conclusions about wiretapping. It seems pretty clear they illegally entered a federal building under false pretenses and attempted access to, or got access to, phone lines. It is not clear that they were seeking to tap the phones. If we go nuts on the phone tapping thing and it turns out there is nothing there, the right will claim this as a victory--that the MSM and all us liberals jumped to inappropriate conclusions. And it's very possible they will be right.The Barry Familyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15928233396511411493noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-20679939041451463972010-01-27T13:09:39.204-08:002010-01-27T13:09:39.204-08:00I suspect that they can't grasp how much troub...I suspect that they can't grasp how much trouble they're in. The prosecutors just have it in for them since it's a democratic senator, see, and if they had any real evidence they wouldn't have to go through with an actual arraignment and mock prosecution. If the prosecutors really had evidence of a real crime then they would have to let them go since the necessity of their actions would be self-evident!<br /><br />Logic? What's that?<br /><br />BTW put me in the camp of saying that they need to spend some serious time in prison. Even if they're as clueless as they seem that doesn't change 1) the fact that they tried to commit espionage against a sitting senator and 2) you don't want to establish any sort of precedence for the next guy who's much more serious. They were incredibly sloppy but they did go to the effort of finding 'appropriate' clothing, etc., so it's clearly premeditated. They need felony convictions and to spend at least 5 years in prison.<br /><br />Oh yeah, and sense thirty-odd Republicans thought Congress needed to issue a proclamation on their behalf after ACORN I think it's only fitting that there be another proclamation (after conviction, to avoid tainting the prosecution) condemning this cowardly and irresponsible act.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15204551931362270258noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-76115193256019123882010-01-27T12:44:10.462-08:002010-01-27T12:44:10.462-08:00Amateurs. Their loafer tassles and hair gel gave t...Amateurs. Their loafer tassles and hair gel gave them away.That guyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04035618403830225456noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-37702922093821087732010-01-27T12:43:01.207-08:002010-01-27T12:43:01.207-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.That guyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04035618403830225456noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-55425999420022569342010-01-27T12:35:02.754-08:002010-01-27T12:35:02.754-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10933441478296178036noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-41338960223762537152010-01-27T12:34:20.023-08:002010-01-27T12:34:20.023-08:00This should be treated as a case of espionage, abs...This should be treated as a case of espionage, absolutely no different than Watergate. There is no reason to discount a larger criminal conspiracy to either compromise a US Senator or the security of the United States. This was a very serious crime, and I believe warrants a widespread investigation. Congress passed a law against ACORN based on these guys' fishing party. They should be rigorously investigated by Congress, just as ACORN was investigated. It seems they were looking for bigger fish.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10933441478296178036noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-54505027111345081862010-01-27T12:18:21.870-08:002010-01-27T12:18:21.870-08:00I think they should serve exactly the same amount ...I think they should serve exactly the same amount of time as if they were young, brown, had a muslim name and tried to tap a senator's phone system. Somehow I don't think that would be "three weeks".tavellahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02850891086706939932noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-58909150149760643412010-01-27T12:17:08.786-08:002010-01-27T12:17:08.786-08:00Why did the idiots go after a DINO in the first pl...Why did the idiots go after a DINO in the first place? She's only a Democrat because a Repub can't get elected in her district.merlallenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01023548198899856438noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-63279334336383784512010-01-27T12:07:33.868-08:002010-01-27T12:07:33.868-08:00Reading the affidavit, I'm noticing that there...Reading the affidavit, I'm noticing that there is no specific mention of wiretapping or wiretapping equipment.<br /><br />It would seem to me that unless they had the equipment required to tap the senator's phones - all this wiretapping talk may be a bit premature.<br /><br />I'd agree that their plan seems amazingly short sighted if wiretapping was their actual intention. If all they intended to do was to gain access and then embarras the senator with how easy it was to gain access - then their videotape makes a little more sense. (Not a lot more, mind you - because it would still show them committing a crime - but not in the same ballpark as videotaping a federal crime.)<br /><br />Presumably the video of the phone would not have been able to show the fake phone techs doing whatever they were planning on doing to the phones - so you wonder what their plan for the video was.<br /><br />Very strange.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00514644200381624965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-86635904463864811412010-01-27T11:58:54.120-08:002010-01-27T11:58:54.120-08:00My guess is one of these guys is going to flip and...My guess is one of these guys is going to flip and reveal the whole plot. Mr. O'Keefe is about to find out who his real friends in the Republican party are. I hope he serves at least 3-5 years for his trouble.ubulujajahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15284139446988227524noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-11723440464701544682010-01-27T11:54:33.795-08:002010-01-27T11:54:33.795-08:00@marya: It's really not that simple - what the...@marya: It's really not that simple - what they did was attempted espionage against a member of the Homeland Security Committee. If we caught J. Random Arab doing it, he'd probably be looking at 10-20 years in the federal pen. The only way I'd like to see these idiots get less is if they account for who exactly put them up to this plan.Matt joneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05972274369585451523noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-4307289540450884882010-01-27T11:43:11.144-08:002010-01-27T11:43:11.144-08:00I don't think people who aspire to wiretap oth...I don't think people who aspire to wiretap other people, for whatever reason, deserve any sympathy. What these boys did was malicious, and their actions only suggest they have no idea how privacy works in this country. The guy from the previous acorn schemes should know better after questions were raised regarding how he obtained his last video, without the permission of the person he's recording. Something is seriously disturbed with this boy, and he's obviously crying out for attention, the kind of attention a cold dark cell can provide. I dunno if locking him up would do much good, he may just become a martyr, but the idea that any part of his actions can be explained in a way that doesn't leave you with the impession that this person should unpunished, or some kind of leanency, is absolutely absurd. If someone attempted to wiretap me...oh wait...Watchout5https://www.blogger.com/profile/06477964694989968042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-76082545339972472042010-01-27T11:40:32.792-08:002010-01-27T11:40:32.792-08:00If they wanted to play spy, then they should see w...If they wanted to play spy, then they should see what happens to spys who get caught. <br /><br />Lucky for them in this country that only means a term in a SuperMax prison in Colorado. <br /><br />In most other countries... "O'keefe who? Never heard of him"<br /><br />These are big-boys playing with big-boy toys. Espionage is not a game.Jack Duluozhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08156185824428108757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-31229940115087462882010-01-27T11:29:44.999-08:002010-01-27T11:29:44.999-08:00The young men who, allegedly, decided to enter a F...<i>The young men who, allegedly, decided to enter a Federal building and bug the phones in a United State's senator's office, are not hardened criminals. They are 20somethings whose heads have been swollen ... If found guilty I do not think they should go unpunished. <b>However, I don't think they should serve any time, at least not more than, say, 3 weeks.</b></i><br /><br />I don't consider myself a "bleeding heart" (in actuality I consider myself a pretty callous bastard in a lot of ways), but I am a liberal and <b>ABSOLUTELY DISAGREE</b>. Not for reasons of petty sadism or revenge (as fun as that is), but out of pure pragmatism. <br /><br />If you give these wankers a slap on the wrist, the message you send to the legions of other young wingnut wankers out there is: "Hey, it's fairly OK to try to wiretap people whom you disagree with politically - you'll get your mug on FOX News and nothing really serious will happen to you if you're caught." If you give them a light sentence, expect to see FOX News bugs being planted in every Democratic Party office and in the offices of any left-leaning advocacy group from the ACLU to MoveOn.org. These clowns must be sent up the river for the whole way, maximum possible terms to be served sequentially, and maximum fines and penalties levied. <i>I want these young men's lives to be utterly destroyed.</i> <br /><br />I want this not out of malice, but out of the need to protect our Republic! For if we let them off, no one who is of any left-leaning bent will effectively have any Constituional protection against unreasonable search & seizure, or any expectation that they can be secure in their homes and their persons! If protecting the most basic meaning of the 1st and 4th Amendments means that these guys must be ruined utterly and their families humiliated, that is a price I'm happy to pay.Rheinhardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13950424664531635251noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-69113163978564627532010-01-27T11:25:24.727-08:002010-01-27T11:25:24.727-08:00They are not young, O'Keefe is 25 years old.They are not young, O'Keefe is 25 years old.Mama Lamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08753472470339785840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-83097843599509338032010-01-27T11:23:21.675-08:002010-01-27T11:23:21.675-08:00PR is right on target. I'm not sure how we can...PR is right on target. I'm not sure how we can be sure of what they were trying to do, and who was behind them, without waterboarding them, at the very least. I say, handcuff them naked in stress positions and leave them on the concrete floor of a cell air-conditioned down to about 50F for a few weeks. 24-year-old white Americans claiming to be Republicans -- hah. Sounds like an absolutely dream Al-Qaida cover.Egypt Stevehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16463550137865978023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-76359242982877228902010-01-27T11:22:14.354-08:002010-01-27T11:22:14.354-08:00The young men who, allegedly, decided to enter a F...<i>The young men who, allegedly, decided to enter a Federal building and bug the phones in a United State's senator's office, are not hardened criminals.</i><br /><br />I'm curious as to why someone thinks their uninformed judgment of the inherent "goodness" of a person who committed a very serious crime matters. Thank God it doesn't.<br /><br />And this bears repeating, a LOT- illegally wiretapping a public official (or even a fellow citizen) is a VERY SERIOUS CRIME, regardless of who does it. There is NO GOOD INTENT behind that action. None. So the idea that these guys are not "hardened criminals" (whatever that means) is just absurd.<br /><br />Again- illegal wiretapping is a belligerent and malicious act, by definition undertaken by "hardened criminal" minds. This isn't a joke, this isn't funny, and these guys deserve no sympathy.cfaller96https://www.blogger.com/profile/15417003134046992615noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-7220489197393435742010-01-27T10:58:50.043-08:002010-01-27T10:58:50.043-08:00These guys were rank amateurs. They clearly did no...These guys were rank amateurs. They clearly did not think this through AT ALL. Like most right-wingers caught up in their right-wing fantasy world - where they get all their 'facts' from Fox News and Conservapedia and Rush Limbaugh - they deluded themselves into some kind of reality distortion sphere. They spent too much time watching movies and reading right-wing blogs and fantasizing about being some kind of 'radical activists'.<br /><br />If they had given any thought to what they were talking about doing, they would have thought of many of the issues you and your commenters mentioned. They would have had fake badges done up, those would have gone a long way towards helping them pull off their scheme. They would have thought through every angle of the operation. They would have 'tested' security at the building. They would have thought far enough in advance to consider what they would do with any 'intelligence' their bugging would have gotten them.<br /><br />But, as usual with right-wing morons, they can only exist in their bubble for so long. Just like Bush/Cheney and the neo-cons with Iraq, reality is about to give them a huge bitch-slap.rynatohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11196995698782515443noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-15946902537547985082010-01-27T10:54:28.687-08:002010-01-27T10:54:28.687-08:00Like Marya, I'm a bleeding heart liberal, too....Like Marya, I'm a bleeding heart liberal, too. And I think these young men should stand fast with their black brothers and demand disproportional sentencing!<br /><br />That's right. They should demand the right to be incarcerated instead of getting paroled and serve a sentence at least twice as long as the average white criminal. And they should demand their sentences be conducted in a maximum security prison instead of some low-security facility!<br /><br />Further, they should eschew receiving any support from friends or family and have to rely on an under-funded, frequently inept Public Defender, like the ones so common in Texas Death Penalty cases....!<br /><br />After, solidarity bros! Let's show the man!MosesZDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12702323080585738748noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-65526733685983358682010-01-27T10:52:29.971-08:002010-01-27T10:52:29.971-08:00One of these adults (18 and over, folks, really) i...One of these adults (18 and over, folks, really) is the son of a Federal District Attorney in Louisiana. Now, I know for all the pablum about family values the GOP likes to push they're not always up to their own hype, but really... there must of been at least a little dinner table conversation from William J. Flanagan that could have clued in Robert Flanagan as to how something like this stunt would have terrible consequences. These mini G. Gordon Liddy's should get the maximum penalty if they're found guilty.Ἰάσωνhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03932947509753946404noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-19545995590140589892010-01-27T10:52:08.264-08:002010-01-27T10:52:08.264-08:00@graydon:when they came out with their new expose ...@graydon:<i>when they came out with their new expose on Landreau, they would have exposed themselves than and there as having broken the law.</i><br /><br />True. Which is why I think it was more Watergate-y and less ACORN-y. They (or the people hiring them) might have planned on using the intelligence gathered, without actually coming out with an exposé.Stevehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05127895117307971714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21760390.post-24698215456148355872010-01-27T10:51:45.786-08:002010-01-27T10:51:45.786-08:00*Follow The Money* They are not operating on their...*Follow The Money* They are not operating on their own.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03374824390935759417noreply@blogger.com